Electric PT Cruiser couldn't cut it as NY taxi
Although New York City mayor Michael Bloomberg has decreed that all cabs in the city must be propelled by at least a hybrid powertrain by 2012, moving to full battery propulsion looks like it's going to have to wait a bit longer. The Ford Escape Hybrids that have been in service for the past two years have been working great, but a test of battery powered Chrysler PT Cruiser was not so successful.
The PT converted to lithium battery power by Hybrid Technologies and tested in service as a cab for several months this year was never able to achieve the average distance for a cab of 100 miles per shift and never lasted a full ten-hour shift. The best it got was ninety miles one time and usually packed it in after only forty miles. It also didn't perform well in cold temperatures. The Taxi and Limousine Commission returned the car to Hybrid Technologies in June and will continue looking for other vehicles to test.
[Source: AM New York, thanks to Darryl for the tip]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
A.Brien 11:15AM (7/16/2007)
LOL, not a great news for battery vehicle proponents. It's lithim ion battery too.
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Doug Korthof 11:23AM (7/16/2007)
120-mile range Toyota RAV4-EV uses superior Nickel Metal Hydride batteries, perhaps these fools should have studied the batteries and learned that Lithium is more expensive and less powerful.
http://SealBeach.org to see a 120-mile range Toyota RAV4-EV which is entirely powered by solar rooftop electric credits. No oil, no "well to wheels", no smog checks, no gasoline.
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kentavos 11:42AM (7/16/2007)
Makes me wonder about their claims on the Electric Mini. Also, I wonder why such the poor performance.
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Charles S 11:56AM (7/16/2007)
I have always scratched my head in regards to using an electric car for Taxi services. At current stage, hybrids makes more sense in both economy and efficiency. What an electric car should be, for now, is a short-distance, urban commuter, which majority of Americans do with their cars for at least 5 days a week. For a two-car family, I'd be more than happy to trade one of them in for an electric car that will do 40-miles round trip.
The most likely reason that it couldn't make the 100-miles mark is because of the way it was used; taxis often involve hard starts and stops, extra weight, etc. Electric motors are much more efficient than gasoline engines, however, a typical battery-array in an electric car may have the equivalent of less than one gallon of gasoline on board. Faster acceleration and additional weight will change the performance parameters and thus affecting the range. On the other hand, for a typical routine commuter, the performance should be within the guidelines, but even a 40 miles range would be fine for most people, including myself.
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MikeW 12:31PM (7/16/2007)
How about Bloomberg give 1/2 billion so Ford can make a modern rear drive [american] car. Move the crown vic to unibody, 6 speed auto, independent suspension, fuel tank within the wheelbase. [sounds like DEW98]
Then throw another 1/2 billion so Ford can get in on the dual mode hybrid action that GM-DCX-BMW will be using.
Then another 1/2 billion for battery development, and yet another 1/2 for material science research.
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david lyall 12:05AM (3/20/2009)
body on frame and solid truck axle makes the most sense for a taxi/police car. The Panther platform is perfect. A heavy duty hybrid transmission is what is required, and far beyond the investment abilities of the current auto industry. The Crown Vic gives the most interior space for the vehicle weight of anything out there. Minivans are terrible in comparison, to say nothing of the entrance problem for old people. I drive a taxi and am looking into buying an Escape hybrid. A stretched Escape would be nice.
matt 12:30PM (7/16/2007)
If you want to win a horse race, start with a retarded horse.
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GoodCheer 12:51PM (7/16/2007)
I don't know the numbers of energy use, but the 100 miles covered in an average taxi shift may well become less important than it's 10 hour duration when the EV battery is being asked to run AC / cabin heat, lights and radios pretty much constantly for that time. At an average speed of 10 mph I imagine energy lost to 'normal driving losses' like aerodynamic drag and rolling resistance would be minimal.
Just based on the fact that AC fuses are ~30A, I would infer that running the AC for an hour takes about 400kJ of energy.
While Hybrid Technologies' range claims of 120 miles may be under optimal conditions that most will never see, I doubt many potential EV buyers plan to spend 10 hours at a stretch in their cars at any speed.
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Manu Sharma 1:00PM (7/16/2007)
This is really ridiculous that they can't make this work. Forget the battery life, in a limited area test, they should have installed pulse electric chargers at a few key selected locations. Or they could have put "battery stations" in place where you just get under the car and swap the battery back.
Really, it's like they wanted this to fail from the start. Why is it so hard to put a charging/battery infrastructure in place at 5-6 key locations when you're talking about a defined geographic area?
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AES 2:42PM (7/16/2007)
Given that modern lithium ion batteries - like the LiPO and LiFePO4 cells being planned for the Chevy Volt - have an operating range down to -30C, I think this failure is more attributable to HybridTech's engineering incompetence more than the fundamental technology. I remember a CNN video that featured HybridTech definitely included clips of their cars spontaneously breaking down.
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Joseph 3:51PM (7/16/2007)
40 miles?
That is worse than even the first gen EV1 !!!!!
What is wrong with this company??? Old EVs from the 90's got 50-90 of range on average using battery technology that had 2-3x LESS energy than this PT Cruiser's Lithium ion pack !!!
Get a Tesla Roadster as a taxi instead!
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Jack S. 6:50PM (7/16/2007)
Not surprised given the way cab drivers drive in NYC. From each red light changing green to the next the driver stomps on the accelerator only to brake for the next red light because it hasn't changed green yet since it's timed to a) the posted speed limit and b) normal acceleration .
I'm curious how efficient the hybrids really are given that type of driving habit..maybe it balances it out with LOTS of regenerative braking?
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Chris M 10:48PM (7/16/2007)
One good thing about it is that there will be some used PT Cruiser EVs going on the market soon. Keep an eye on EBay motors, maybe you can snag one.
Then consider adding more batteries.
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BJD 12:11AM (7/17/2007)
Now throw one of Altair's Nanosafe battery packs in that same PT Cruiser and watch how well it performs!!!! No need to research anything more.
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LaughingTooHard 8:56AM (7/17/2007)
Manu Sharma,
I have to question if you have ever been to NYC? "Key locations"? Like where? Can you whip up a quick placement design for said "Battery Swap" stations? Seeing as many cabs serve the whole 5 boroughs I think you'd need more than 5-6. More like 50-100.
The problem is quite simple, mostly tourists use cabs, not NY'ers. Unless it is raining, then even NY'ers cave in. I say double or triple the price of a cab ride for everyone besides the elderly THEN you might be able to afford said infrastructure. Make the lazy "Snobs" who think the MTA is for lessor creatures, carry the burden.
MikeW, I am with you - convert all the existing Cron Vics and Impalas to electric. Why buy $30k-40K electric cars when you can retrofit the existing ones for a fraction of the price. THEN you can get the cab companies to support the quick charging infrastructure.
Besides who wants to ride in PT cruiser or Prius?
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thesawzall 1:41PM (7/17/2007)
It ought to have a small combustion engine just for running the A/C or heater. The constant use of those in stop and go traffic could put a serious dent in the actual range of the vehicle.
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Greg A. 3:24PM (7/17/2007)
"Seeing as many cabs serve the whole 5 boroughs..."
Now *I'm* laughing too hard. Cab drivers want to go where there is a good chance of finding their next fare. Most, if not nearly all, will frown upon someone who wants to go somewhere other than Manhattan or a trendy part of Brooklyn (or possibly one of the airports in Queens).
"Besides who wants to ride in PT cruiser or Prius?"
Actually, I've seen Priuses being used as livery cars.
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LaughingTooHard 6:51PM (7/18/2007)
Glad I could make you chuckle(head).
According to you, only rich white people take cabs. True they have the best chances of getting picked up but that is a whole other story.
Thanks for representing the elitist white minority, but even by your own admission, at one or two go more than 20 blocks at least once in a while.
TLC data shows 2.8 miles is an average trip and 38% of 240m rides per year are extra-Manhattan trips. Add that to 32% of outbound Manhattan passengers to NY airports using cabs and nearly 47% of inbound passengers using cabs to return to Manhattan, I think your argument is pretty shot.
Thanks for playing.
Cabs need more than 100 mile range and more than a few "quick battery swap" stations.
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strangway 5:22PM (7/24/2007)
Wow, gas or electric, PT Cruisers suck either way.
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whatthe 4:21PM (1/20/2008)
ah.. The way NY cab drivers drive you'd probably get a third less per mpg. So if you have a car that performs 30mpg then it'll be 20. Only reason gas works is because you can fill up every time no matter how inefficiently you drive.
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