Ex-CIA Chief James Woolsey Gives Hydrogen Hell
One day before what could be an historic vote of the California Air Resources Board (CARB) that happens today, Plug In America held a press conference and rally to press the case for a strong Zero Emission Vehicle (ZEV) program. Directly opposite the California EPA building, a large banner was dropped during the event with a message for CARB: "Electric Cars for a Change." Activists hope to move the CARB Board members to reject the staff proposal to cut by 90 percent the number of zero-emission vehicles now required of the major automakers by 2015 (currently set at 25,000). One additional major point of contention with the program has been the tilt toward hydrogen and fuel cells embedded in the ZEV program since 2003, when a revision ended the agency's promotion of battery electric cars. Jim Woolsey, former Chief of Central Intelligence, flew across the country to add his voice to the activists call for parity between fuel cell and battery electric cars. Woolsey railed against the expense and inefficiency of hydrogen for vehicles in a preview of his testimony to come on Thursday (today). (Full disclosure: I am on the Board of Plug In America)
[Source: Plug In America]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
A.Brien 12:10PM (3/27/2008)
Why in the first place nobody can't put on the market right now a pluging hybrid(gasoline+electric plug)? This technology already exist, there is millions of gasoline outlets and every home and working places have 110 volts plug. It's the easiest way to cut gasoline expense. The world is upside down. manufacturers have build and tested complicated and very expensive hydrogen fuelcell cars but they didn't build and tested plug-in hybrid ??? They say that fuelcell are good in 2015 or later and there is many on the roads right now. Then they say that pluging will come first because it's less complicated and cheaper but there is not on the road being tested. Just the volt seam near ready but it's still on the drawing board? I think that the volt and some other projects from others car manufacturers can be tested in the next 2-3 weeks. With that you will never have a breakdown because it use already available and tested technologies internal combustion engine and battery tested in the 1990s by Gm ev1 and toyota rav4 electric.
There is a mystery going on on this subject. I think that some business people wait for the o.k from the oil-military-politics-taxation business gang that rule the world right now. If they continue to wait for the ok then it will never happen.
One good consept for a plug in hybrid will be electric drive of 130 hp with the smallest battery for 20-40 miles and an internal small combustion gas engine+ generator recharging the battery at hign rpm. A size of 500cc 2 cylinders of 40 hp
should be enouph even a smaller engine of 20 hp can be sufficient. A car only need peak power very few often.
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Bob Moffitt (Bob from ALAMN) 12:38PM (3/27/2008)
Jumping from one technology to another is one of the frustrations with CARB and California's aproach to cleaner cars and fuels.
Minnesota became the biofuel leader of North America by sticking to the program. In April, a Thai delegation will visit Minnesota to learn about E85, and we will be in Sacramento next month to present the lessions learned here.
Last year, Minnesotans bought more than 21 million gallons of E85. We figure that this reduced greenhouse emissions by 97,000 tons.
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David Wright 12:21PM (3/27/2008)
The 'hydrogen highway' is no such thing. It's a cul-de-sac. Pursuit of a distant hydrogen dream - which many of its supporters concede will take decades to bring to fruition - is merely a way of ensuring that we remain tied to oil for those years in between. It suits the oil industry for people to focus on hydrogen - rather than adopting the plug-in battery alternative, for which the infrastructure exists already. Electricity is available everywhere, and the installation of recharge points is a doddle - compared with the disruption and expense and delay in constructing a wholly new nationwide hydrogen storage and delivery infrastructure.
Those with a vested interest in oil, and in keeping the infernal combustion engine alive long after it should be retired, are perfectly happy to see hydrogen promoted. Sustaining a hydrogen dream, rather than accepting an electric reality, ties us to the gas pump.
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rooting for plug ins 1:13AM (3/29/2008)
Marc,
I'd like to know if there is a way to get more involved directly with plug-in america. There seems to be a closed network. I tried talking to a person involved with plug in america before but that person was reluctant to even offer me more info besides contacting the CARB which doesn't get me info like this video shows. I signed some papers and gave my email but got no info. I would've been there if the organization would be more open to info and direct involvement. anyways good luck. I root for your guys in spirit.
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Cervus 1:10PM (3/27/2008)
Pray, tell me how any auto company can guarantee that they will sell X number of ZEVs? I really don't understand how a goverment agency can have that kind of mandate. Nobody can force me, as a consumer, to purchase an electric vehicle that doesn't meet my needs.
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Whopper 1:41PM (3/27/2008)
"Jumping from one technology to another is one of the frustrations with CARB and California's aproach to cleaner cars and fuels. " THIS IS THE PENALTY YOU PAY WHEN YOU ATTEMPT TO LEGISLATE ENGINEERING AND CONSUMER ACTIVITY! CAFE is a joke and CARB is a farce!
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KarenRei 1:46PM (3/27/2008)
"Why in the first place nobody can't put on the market right now a pluging hybrid(gasoline+electric plug)?"
They're working on it. Unfortunately, it takes time to turn a vehicle from a design concept to a mass-produced vehicle on the road. Your question should be, "why did it take so long for these programs to get started". And the answer is, they didn't want to pay for the R&D and for years of initial losses when they didn't have to.
"I really don't understand how a goverment agency can have that kind of mandate."
It's easy: it forces them to have to put something on the market, whether they think they can make an immediate profit on it or not, with the goal of the greater interests of the state, the country, and the world being served by advancing the technology. And yes, they can sell as many as they want. It may initially take *subsidy* of ZEV models, financed by charging more for non-ZEV models, but it's doubtful that it would once mass production kicks in and lowers battery prices.
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Whopper 4:01PM (3/27/2008)
"It's easy: it forces them to have to put something on the market, whether they think they can make an immediate profit on it or not, with the goal of the greater interests of the state, the country, and the world being served by advancing the technology." Ah yes commrad, and you vill be happy doing zis! Welcome to the communist state where the wellbeing of the state surpasses those of individuals. Karen, there are people who have investments in these companies. Stockholders have a right to expect these companies to make a profit, which is what the corporate execs are charged with doing. If the public won't buy the damned things they'll sit on the lot. People will keep their gas burners longer and NOTHING IS ACCOMPLISHED! Oh, but in your scheme of things, the government would then mandate that people MUST buy the EV's or not drive. So we then restrict choice, which is the type of control all despots like to have.
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KarenRei 6:29PM (3/27/2008)
"Stockholders have a right to expect these companies to make a profit, which is what the corporate execs are charged with doing. If the public won't buy the damned things they'll sit on the lot."
People *will* buy them if they make the price cheap enough. They're not going to just "sit on the lot". Even if they have to give them away, *someone* will take them. And back in the real world, it's not a "someone will take them" situation, but a "people will leap for the chance to own one" situation. They don't need to be free -- they just need to be
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Michael 12:44PM (3/28/2008)
"Minnesota became the biofuel leader of North America by sticking to the program. In April, a Thai delegation will visit Minnesota to learn about E85, and we will be in Sacramento next month to present the lessions learned here.
Last year, Minnesotans bought more than 21 million gallons of E85. We figure that this reduced greenhouse emissions by 97,000 tons."
According to who? Considering it takes nearly the identical amount of power to produce E85 as is produced when all is said and done. Not to mention the increase in food prices caused by the push for increased ethanol and the farmers and producers that are out of business because they had to sell for less than it cost to produce. Some concept.
Is plug in the way to go? I doubt it until batteries are more advanced.
Modern diesels (bluetech) are clean and efficient if pair with hybrid technology that would be every beneficial in the short term. Ie BMW X6 Active hybrid concept.
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Whopper 2:08PM (3/28/2008)
Karen, the Prius has less than 1% of the market. That doesn't sound like people are jumping at the chance to buy them. Get real!
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