Toyota wants to know what people think about higher gas taxes
One of the most contentious issues in the discussion of how to wean ourselves off oil is fuel taxes. In spite of the campaign contributions that politicians get from car makers, when push come to shove on efficiency they get the short end of the stick. That's because in this country almost any politician that even hints at raising taxes on anything will get crucified by anti-tax lobbyists. So even though higher fuel prices (through taxes) will drive demand for more efficient vehicles, politicians find it more expedient to mandate higher efficiency from car makers regardless of what consumers might be demanding.During the debate over CAFE standards most of the automaker representatives have repeatedly said the gas taxes should go up along with the efficiency mandates. If that happens they will have no problem selling more efficient vehicles. However, you rarely - if ever - heard that reported in the media, although we have written about it here numerous times. Now, Toyota is openly asking the question at the Open Road Blog. They want to know what people really think about gas taxes. What do you think?
[Source: Toyota]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Tim 6:40PM (4/26/2008)
Higher fuel taxes will turn this recession into a depression. They may promise to earmark the funds for tech that will remove the yoke of oil from our necks, but politicians can't control themselves and will very soon waste the extra income on pet pork projects and socialist entitlement spending.
This happens EVERY time taxed are increased.
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Hans Wurst 6:43PM (4/26/2008)
Make sure the tax pays for improvement of transportation and I’d be happy to pay! How did you think the nice German Autobahn is paid for?
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BlackbirdHighway 7:33PM (4/26/2008)
Once I get delivery of my electric car, yes, go ahead and raise the gas tax as much as you want.
Oh, wait, Toyota doesn't have anything you can plug in. So why are they even asking? That's just stupid!
Now if Tesla were to advocate higher gas taxes, that I could understand.
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Kevin Nugent 9:41PM (4/26/2008)
ummm . i dont think raising taxes is a good idea. The manufacturers are just trying to boost their overall profit because they will have to get off tehir asses and do research to get higher mpgs. Essentially they are saying " well since we are going to give you a better product im going to make you but it"I say no . Let us come to them when we want Adding to the fact that millions of Americans are not just going to swap out tehir cars just to get the new design . That is not how it works !
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Richard 10:30PM (4/26/2008)
I've been advocating higher taxes for a long time, it's the only way that we are going to get more efficient cars. For proof of that look at Europe. They have the highest gasoline prices and everybody demands smaller, more efficient cars because of it. We Americans act like it's our God given right to have cheap fuel, we'll those days are over. I hate paying so much for gas, but what's worse is that there aren't many choices for efficient cars. I look forward to EV's, when they come out, until then, i'll pay for higher taxed fuel.
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gsolman6 5:58PM (4/27/2008)
Maybe it will take a few more major bridge collapses in this country before people will realize they can't get something for nothing.
Not all politicians waste money and the private sector invests in a lot of hogwash too (Windows ME, Olestra, Ritalin, etc.)
The difference with money that is taxed and money spent on oil is that in the case of the former most of the money remains in this country while in the latter case most of it goes abroad.
Long ago the Europeans had the idea of tax gas enough so that people use it judiciously and also that their economies will not be so dependent on a unstable commodity. Of course the Europeans are not in a depression so it will not cause one here. Even if you double the federal gas tax (18 cents) that increase would still be a fraction of the increase we have seen in gas prices the last three years.
Increasing the gas tax is a better solution that CAFE since the latter still give no incentive for people to actually drive less once they have their new vehicle with X% better mandated MPG.
I also have no problem with the gas tax being used as a sin tax since the likes of the British gov't have issued studies that global warming could cost between 1 and 20% of world GDP. It that is true we actually need massive fuel taxes to wean us rather quickly............
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Joseph 12:39PM (4/27/2008)
I don't think it's a good time to raise taxes on fuel (which raises prices for everything) when the economy is slowing down, but once the economy picks up its pace again I think a fuel tax would be good.
As fuel-economy rises, because of the improved CAFE standards, gas prices will probably drop. A fuel tax would be a good way to keep gas prices high enough to keep consumer demand for smaller vehicles. If gas prices stayed lower, then people would demand larger vehicles and automakers will probably have a harder time keeping up with CAFE standards when it's so tempting to sell SUVs to willing customers. (From what I can tell, this is what happened in the 80s and 90s)
So...in the near future, a gas tax would help keep America in more fuel-efficient vehicles. However, I doubt a gas tax would reduce the number of miles driven by any meaningful amount.
I really would hate a gas tax. It's so, so...Un-American. But, it works (I think) and it's for the good of the people.
Besides, all the people who want nationalized healthcare (and better bridges) will have to get the money from somewhere.
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GenWaylaid 11:50PM (4/26/2008)
Okay, here's the problem: I can't afford a new car. I won't be able to for years. Making me pay more for gasoline will only make the problem WORSE.
I'll be in favor of a gas tax when it only applies to "cashed up greenies" who can afford it.
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jamesFF 12:39AM (4/27/2008)
I agree with GenWaylaid, raising the gas tax only hurts the poor who can't afford a new car.
All the cars I was able to buy were over 10 years old, had more than 100K miles, and priced $1000 or less.
Most fuel saving 4 cylinder engines are dead or are ready to go by the time they reach this age.
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Derek 8:34AM (4/27/2008)
James, you need to shop in different places or learn to work on your car. 10 years/100K is far from a car breaking down. I'd consider a car just about broken in at that point unless you are shopping the "for sale" signs in the local high school parking lot!
My g/f's first car was over 10 years/100K and she traded it six years and many thousand miles later for a small truck and several hundred $$$. My daily driver is over 160,000 and 16 years old and I wouldn't hesitate to drive it anywhere at this very moment, nor do I anticipate replacing it anytime soon. In the eight years since I started driving the car, it has needed nothing outside of regular maintenance items (brake pads, tires, air filter, etc).
On topic, I can't say that I am in *favor* of a higher gas tax (I like cheap gas and keeping more money in my checking account) but I would not oppose it. Anything to get people to stop driving trucks everywhere and get some more appealing cars on the market.
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Wildgoosechase 9:49PM (4/27/2008)
What the higher CAFE numbers have created is a time bomb for future politicians to deal with. As MPG rises less fuel is used, less gas tax revenue is generated. So is the future we will face as "crisis" and some politician will have to commit political suicide and raise taxes. But for now, politicians can celebrate their victory…
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busted 10:49AM (4/28/2008)
In case the kind folks at Toyota have not been paying attention (why else the question)givng more tax revenue to government will not solve any problems we have with fuel supplies - real and imagined. Just take a good look around you. What exactly is government doing with the tax revenue they already collect that does much real good for anyone not working for government? As for using less fuel because we are moving towards more fuel efficient vehicles - ain't gonna happen. People learn quickly enough they can drive further for the same cost with higher mileage vehicles, so no fuel savings takes place.
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brn 1:20PM (4/28/2008)
The problem isn't the taxes. The problem is the price of gas.
It amazes me that people will riot over a $0.10 increase in the gas tax. At the same time, they put up with (not willingly) a $2.00 increase in gas prices. I don't care about the ten cents. I care about the two dollars.
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Mike 2:39PM (4/28/2008)
Tim is right. I live in New York. This state is the poster child for taxes NOT going to what they're suppose to. Our elected official steal more funds for their pockets than any other state.
How about blaming the car companies for not making any improvements on mpg until their forced too. Two years ago GM and OTHERS said hybrid technology wouldn't be available until 2015 or 2020, Now they have them!
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brn 4:18PM (4/28/2008)
"Two years ago GM and OTHERS said hybrid technology wouldn't be available until 2015 or 2020"
That's funny. Two years ago (2005-2006), Ford, Honda, GM, and Toyota all produced hybrid vehicles.
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Gastax 11:52PM (5/02/2008)
The key to raising fuel tax is to lower income tax (both personal and coporate) and/or other taxes to compensate the toll we hit it may put on people in the lower income bracket. Additional fuel tax by itself is not good, but if it's close to a wash at the end comparing to income tax, then people should start being more energy efficient and saving more.
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vyking 1:02AM (4/29/2008)
I am going to go against the flow here. The gas tax is a good idea. But it has to be done right.
Here are the reasons to do it:
Reason One:
We are paying a tax on fuel right now, you just don't pay it at the pump. We are fighting a war and our people (as well as innocent people) are dying just so we can get cheaper oil. A large part of our military and intelligence community expenditures go directly to protect the flow of crude from the middle east. How much is the war in Iraq going to cost us? Well it is at 500 billion right now... the U.S. consumes about 146 billion gallons of gas per year. So by my calculations we are using 400,000,000 gallons a day. So in order to pay for "cheaper" gas, we would need a 1.00 tax per gallon just to keep the $341.4 million per day war in check. But, because no one will ever allow the gas tax to happen (because it is political suicide) we will just continue to tax evil things like... working! Yeah..That will teach those overachievers!
Reason two:
A lot of the people that sell us oil are not our friends: Saudis, Iraqis, Nigerians, Iranians and Venezuelans. We are making these people rich, and if you ask me, I would prefer if the people that did not like me did not get rich off my labor.
Reason three:
Burning oil is a messy business. We should not burn it unless we need to. Our kids will thank us for this.
Reason four:
Oil is finite. If you leave it to the market the price will go up anyway. So why not put the money in our pockets rather than some sheik's so he can buy another Veyron.
So here is how to do it...
Step one:
Don't tax anyone this year.
Step two:
Raise it in small amounts that grow larger over time. E.g, 10 cent a gallon in 2009, 20 cents a gallon in 2010, 30 cents in 2011.
The reason behind this is simple, people can't dump a car they bought today without taking a big hit in the pocketbook. But a slow increase will put the writing on the wall for all the people looking to buy today. If you knew that in 5 years gas would be at a minimum 50 cents more per gallon than today you might buy a more efficient car.
Step 3:
Only levy the tax on foreign oil. Sure the free trade people would go crazy, but those are the same people that want U.S. workers to compete with the sweat shops of the 3rd world.
Step 4:
Make every cent of the tax that is generated go to reducing consumption of foreign energy. Such as credits for alternative fuel vehicles, plug in hybrids, R&D funding, etc.
Once we are free from the yoke of foreign oil I believe the price of oil will begin to drop sharply. The Saudis, Nigerians, and Venezuelans will be drowning in oil that the US will not be buying, and if we do buy it, it will be taxed to hell. The palaces in the deserts will begin to crumble and we will then be free to mind our own business in the world.
/end rant
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tark 2:08AM (4/29/2008)
vyking is right on most. I would also like to see some sliding scale tax on new vehicles based on mileage.
The only way we could not tax domestic would be to put the tax on a barrel. This would cause alot of pain in other uses like plastic and fertilizer.
They will not be drowning in oil as we reduce consumption because of the emerging consumer class in China and India. Both countries have very little pollution controls so the greenhouse will go up.
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