CARB backs off of plug-in conversion shop
Chris Duffey - East Bay Express
The California Air Resources Board has modified a proposed rule that would have likely put most plug-in hybrid conversion shops in the state out of business. The rule would have required conversion shops to conduct the same emissions tests done by automaker to verify that conversions did not increase noxious emissions. The tests can cost upwards of $200,000 and smaller shops like 3Prong Power simply couldn't afford it.
The shops had proposed being allowed to convert up to 100 vehicles before having to conduct the emissions tests. CARB compromised and modified the rules to allow 50 conversions before testing would have to be done. This would allow shops to get established and build some revenue before expending the money. The issue is that most noxious (non-greenhouse gas) emissions are produced following a cold start. Automakers calibrate hybrid powertrains to make sure that following the first start, the engine runs long enough to warm the catalytic converter. The concern was that modifications to the powertrain would modify this control preventing the catalyst from properly warning.
[Source: East Bay Express]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Phil L. 4:41PM (6/04/2009)
Hmmm - 50 conversions? $200K to test?
This would appear to presume a conversion shop can keep about $4K of profit per conversion. Or afford a lot of debt. Neither seems likely.
Of course, this testing would only apply to a particular type of conversion. A shop that converts multiple types of cars would have to test each type. Multiply the test cost by the number of types of vehicles that the shop converts.
Does this make sense?
This is mostly a feel-good law; a sound bite before an election. In reality, this law just lets small shops survive until they hit the 50 conversion mark (which can take awhile). They're either hoping the law can be changed before then - or presuming that small shops will just shut down after 50, and the same folks will show up under a new name. Interestingly, it would also imply that big shops need to get bigger - to be able to afford the cost. Perhaps testing could be done by an industry organization, and the test results used by all members?
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downtoearth 6:34PM (6/04/2009)
They said "up two".
A car can cost up to 2 million dollars. You can still get one for $14.000.
I'd be more concerned about the plug-in conversion products they offer, its performance and costs. From their page: http://3prongpower.com/products.html
Let's pick a: Small Lithium
Specifications:
EV Range: 20-22
Price (includes installation): $10,700.00
Maximum EV Speed: 52mph
Expected battery life: 5 years
If I'm gonna drive those 20 miles 5 days in a week through 52 weeks in a year over 5 years, I'll cover 26,000 all electric miles. Prius easily does 47 mpg. If we assume a rising price of gas and use, say, $3.20 per gallon, cash saved will be... $1770.
Doh!
Only few die-hard affluent electric car enthusiasts will go for that, for spending $9,000 to save Mother Earth.
I haven't found any details about how they calculate the expected battery life. They should've said how many charge/discharge cycles it's gonna manage. Then, usually a battery is considered dead when its capacity drops below 80%. So basically you could still drive all electric, only over a diminishing range.
Anyway, this stands no chance for mass market deployment. Not with these prices.
Richard in FLA 10:23AM (6/05/2009)
It's really sad that the small business owner, which makes the largest percentage of the tax payers, should have to jump such huge hoops to make a buck. But in contrast, like straight vegetable oil, in Diesel conversions, needs to be kept warm in order not to congeal, why can't engine blocks be fitted with a warming pad and kept warm, avoiding "Cold" starts most of the time? As long as the car is plugged in, the engine block is kept warm. Anybody know if this is possible or feasible?
jharlan 5:06PM (6/04/2009)
Let the dam state test them at their expense! They are really good at proposing new regulations without a dam clue what the unintended consequences would be. It's incompetent government, over regulating the small business into oblivion. What do plug in conversions have to do with exhaust emissions anyway, except they will burn less fuel.
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Richard 9:22PM (6/04/2009)
Did you not read the part in the article about cold starts? Seriously, once the cat heats up the emissions are drastically reduced. Failing to take this into account could very easily end up with a car that, while burning less fuel per year, spits out a lot more waste.
Its actually fairly reasonable, IMO - one of those rules that applies to everyone, as it should. Its not as if they're out there targeting hybrid shops and giving the 500+ HP diesel truck guys a free pass. If you require testing from one class of powertrain modifiers, you need to get it from all.
Phil L. 10:03PM (6/04/2009)
Yes, we saw the part about cold starts. But, ideally, merely adding batteries to an existing hybrid drivetrain should have no effect on cold start performance. If anything, the additional battery capacity should result in fewer cold starts over the life of the vehicle.
harlanx6 1:14AM (6/05/2009)
These little start up shops are providing a service that we can't get auto manufacturers to do for us. They should be encouraged, because I just don't buy that these conversions are going to produce more pollution.