Lotus now offering the Evora chassis to other automakers
Back in the 90s, shortly after Lotus introduced the original Elise, the company made it known that platform was designed to be easily adapted to different applications including different powertrains. Any companies that were interested in a platform for a niche products using its own powertrains were welcome to use the Elise underpinnings. Over the years, it spawned several race and concept cars as well as the Opel GT, Vauxhall VX220 and, of course, the Tesla Roadster.
Now that Lotus finally has its first all-new car in 14 years, the Evora, and several hundred have been delivered to customers, the same offer is again on the table. In fact, this time the presentation from Lotus Engineering even shows the Evora chassis carrying an electric powertrain. The versatile vehicle architecture is made largely from aluminum extrusions which can be cut off in different lengths, allowing the chassis to readily be adjusted for length and width as needed. To date no company that we're aware of has adopted the Evora platform. However, given the comparative success of Tesla in using the Elise as a starting point and the increased size of the Evora, it should do even better for potential customers. The full presentation is after the jump.
[Source: LotusEnthusiast]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 1)
Boyprodigy1 11:46AM (10/28/2009)
It would seem that lotus has found its true calling. They may have a real nack for this chasis engineering stuff.
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Laurens 12:22PM (10/28/2009)
Sensible cars with this platform, have ICE's. Batteries are useless, if the car drives maybe 2000 km a year. And only last 10 years or so?
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Evan 1:08PM (10/28/2009)
Impressive how Lotus has engineered a modern chassis without stamping and forming.
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Bill 2:19PM (10/28/2009)
71 kWh battery, what's that gonna cost?
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letstakeawalk 4:49PM (10/28/2009)
At least about $660 per KWh, so around $46,000?
http://seekingalpha.com/article/129570-lithium-ion-batteries-9-years-of-price-stagnation
Serge 5:11PM (10/28/2009)
"You would probably be getting ripped off if you had to pay that much; you can get them cheaper than that"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DduAbLpZDHg
letstakeawalk 6:27PM (10/28/2009)
LOL @ Ali G (a favorite), but...
"NEDO also analyzed battery cost (not a cell but a battery pack) as of March 2009. It estimates that the cost is about ¥200,000/kWh (approx US$2,016/kWh) for both types of batteries. In respect to output density-oriented batteries, the current energy density is 70Wh/kg, and the output density is 1,800W/kg. Meanwhile, for energy density-oriented batteries, the energy density is 100Wh/kg and the output density is 400W/kg.
According to the target values described in the roadmap, the energy density and output density of output density-oriented batteries will be improved to 70Wh/kg and 2,000W/kg, respectively, and their cost will be reduced by half to about ¥100,000/kWh in 2010. In respect to the energy density-oriented batteries, the energy density and output density are expected to improve to 100Wh/kg and 1,000W/kg, respectively, while the cost will be reduced to about ¥100,000/kWh.
For 2020, the goals are set at 200Wh/kg energy density, 2,500W/kg output density and ¥20,000/kWh for output density-oriented batteries, and 250Wh/kg energy density, 1,500W/kg output density and ¥20,000/kWh for energy density-oriented batteries."
http://techon.nikkeibp.co.jp/english/NEWS_EN/20090304/166687/
I was being very generous, and allowing for a lower price based on mass-production.
The truth is, the Japanese estimate the average price for a li-ion battery to run about $1000 per kWh by mid-2010. I think the estimate I made in my above post was quite fair.
Serge 7:04PM (10/28/2009)
Like he said, "you can get 'em cheaper than that." You have a habit of quoting estimates on variety of topics and this one is no exception:
"It *estimates* that the cost is about ¥200,000/kWh (approx US$2,016/kWh) for both types of batteries"
I prefer to use market information whenever possible. For example, evcomponents.com retails LiFePO4 prismatic cells for $440 / kWh. This is the safest lithium chemistry, so not much is involved in turning cells into a pack. Prices go down with volume purchases. These are not some wishy-washy projections, but hard data. If you look/ask around you may find better deals. But I understand, this notion doesn't fit into the concept of "batteries are expensive, but hydrogen fuels cells are ... hmm ... progressing nicely" ;)
letstakeawalk 7:25PM (10/28/2009)
Fair enough Serge. So your estimate for a 71kWh battery pack would be about $31,000. If you would be so kind, would you link to the specific battery you mention? I'm not sure which battery you're referring to on that site.
I guess that's not too bad, Tesla's Elon Musk says that the 53kWh battery pack in his car would run about $36,000 to replace. Maybe someone should tell him about the deal he could get ordering cut-rate batteries shipped in from China.
http://blogs.edmunds.com/greencaradvisor/2009/02/tesla-battery-pack-replacement-would-be-36000-today-musk-says.html
Andy 11:23PM (10/28/2009)
Google "Thundersky cost" and sniff around untill you find what people are actually paying for iron phosphate batteries at discounted prices retail today. Knock off a 50% distribution margin and you might get close to the x-factory wholesale price.
Estimate the manufacturers margin and that gives you some idea what a cost competetive battery manufacturer can do today.
Cut in bulk deals with pre-cursor and raw material suppliers, scale up manufacturing to reduce OH's, fully depreciate equipment and you quess the potential battery cost.
Don't come to this site and talk about battery costs. When you are actually quoting prices from motivated sellers.
letstakeawalk 11:54AM (10/29/2009)
How big would a 71kWh LiFePo battery pack be? Could someone give the weight and physical dimensions?
Also, I'm still waiting on that link to the specific battery Serge mentioned.
Serge 2:50PM (10/29/2009)
LTW, the prices I listed are based on 1 kWh module. http://www.evcomponents.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=TS-LFP400AHA. Weight is 13.5 kg, volume .0089 m3 / 8.9 L, so gravimetric density is 74 kWh / kg, volumetric 112 kWh / l. For comparison, Roadsters pack (53 kWh capacity) weighs 450 kg, so 117 kWh / kg. Don't know about volumetric parameter.
So, yeah, perhaps not an appropriate replacement for small sports car (don't call Elon just yet), but for a larger vehicle or smaller range - works pretty well. The Lotus document also discusses a flat floor layout for batteries instead of single box, so that may increase options even on this particular frame. Based on my calculations, BYD's e6 EV will be using a 72 kWh LiFePO4 pack as well, so we should see fairly soon how well (or not) packaging such a pack in a vehicle works.
letstakeawalk 4:38PM (10/29/2009)
Thanks Serge. I wasn't trying to make batteries look bad, I was just trying to get to the truth. I'm not surprised that battery packs can be found at cheaper prices than average "estimates", but unless we're talking about a specific pack, it's hard to gauge how appropriate it would be to the application. I suspected LiFePo would have volume problems, so I'm not surprised to hear you admit it wouldn't be appropriate due to size and weight. No harm, no foul, I'd still be interested if you could find a price for a pack that would be weight/volume/power appropriate.
sean lawrence 2:55PM (10/28/2009)
The first nail in Tesla's coffin? Will Chrysler/Fiat adopt it for the ENVI?
Lotus has been hawking their engineering services to automotive customers for more than 30 years.
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Boyprodigy1 3:24PM (10/28/2009)
Lotus designed the Tesla chassis. Tesla bought that from lotus. Anyone else see Tesla buying this one and making a super car out of it?
Stew 5:47PM (10/28/2009)
You mean 'hocking'
Stew
dieqast 2:57PM (10/28/2009)
Chassis is amazing as always by Lotus, but Bill is right. A 71kWh pack is madness and making electric upmarket sports cars (in my opinion the Tesla is a supercar) today has no sense at all. We should stick to electric mainstream sedans and hatchbacks. Hybrid sports cars on the other hand does have some opportunities much like the Honda CR-Z.
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Chris M 1:31AM (10/29/2009)
Not really "madness", just expensive. A 71 Kwh battery should give a 300+mile per charge range. But note in the presentation that the 71 Kwh version was for a high performance 2 seater with the battery pack behind the seats. They also presented a 4 seat design with the batteries packed under the seats, I suspect that would use a smaller capacity battery.
The two EV Evora designs are aimed at two different markets, and they show a degree of design flexibility with Lotus. I suspect that if any auto maker picks up either design, they'll do some customizing and modifications to meet their desired market - think both Tesla Roadster and Dodge Circuit.